I don't like it when civil rights issues are held open to a popular vote. And I like it even less when a religion injects itself into politics. So, I'm happy to see that somebody is at least checking into whether or not the Mormon church broke any laws by pushing so hard on California's Proposition 8. Maybe they didn't, maybe they did, but it is high time we stopped ignoring possible flouting of the law just to be nice.
[Excerpt]
Probe into LDS Church's Prop 8 donations going forward
California's Fair Political Practices Commission (FPPC) confirmed Monday that it will investigate allegations that the LDS Church failed to report nonmonetary contributions to the Yes on Proposition 8 campaign.
An independent nonprofit organization, Californians Against Hate, called for the investigation after the measure passed earlier this month, effectively ending same-sex marriages in that state. . .
Read more at: Salt Lake Tribune
[Excerpt]
Probe into LDS Church's Prop 8 donations going forward
California's Fair Political Practices Commission (FPPC) confirmed Monday that it will investigate allegations that the LDS Church failed to report nonmonetary contributions to the Yes on Proposition 8 campaign.
An independent nonprofit organization, Californians Against Hate, called for the investigation after the measure passed earlier this month, effectively ending same-sex marriages in that state. . .
Read more at: Salt Lake Tribune
Nothing illegal about it. I'll tell you what I'm sick of people thinking Mormons hate Gays. Thats not the case, all we are saying is marriage is between man and woman.
ReplyDeletehttp://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/commentary/same-sex-marriage-and-proposition-8
Bull pucky. If that was all it was, there wouldn't have been such jubilation from the "Yes on 8" crowd when the measure passed. Marriage is between a man and a woman. It can also be between a man and a man, as I know by looking at the ring finger on my left hand, and the acknowledgement of marriage on my wall (and the husband asleep in bed at the moment).
ReplyDeleteThe line that marriage has been unchanged for 5,000 years is a straight-up lie, as any Mormon SHOULD know. And yet the movement (pushed heavily by Mormons) won on the strength of this lie and others.
And by the way, living in Las Vegas, I've met a few Mormons. Curiously, most of them are either "Jack" Mormons, or ex-Mormons. And oddly enough, many of them are gay--I even dated one. And they would dispute the "Mormons don't hate gays" line.
Well, guess what? I am a Mormon, been living the religion for 42 years now and i don't hate gays. So what do ya think about that? Have a nephew whose gay....love him. Have a hair dresser whose gay....love, love him. And have other friends who are gay, and oh my gosh, guess what?! I love them too! So now you know an active, strong, faithful Mormon who DOES NOT hate gays, and never will! Oh and BTW, whoever looks at the picture that goes with this article of two supposed Mormon missionaries....it's so totally obvious they are not real Mormon missionaries and it's disgraceful that anyone in their right mind would protray them in such a manner and disrespect the blood, sweat and tears they put into serving the Lord. If whoever these guys are that dressed up like this took the time to know Mormons at all they would realize what awesome guys missionaries are and would never mock them this way. Oh, and they'd know that they wear black tags, not white. If your going to do it, at least do it right! Just wish all you out there in the world would get to know us for who we are not for what the world has been brain-washed into thinking about us. There are SO MANY misconceptions about Mormons...if you'd just get to know us. Sad. Sad.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous,
ReplyDeletePlease remember that when this was written (8 months ago), the success of Proposition 8 was still fresh. As one half of one of the 18,000 same-sex couples that got married in California, the vote had some sting. As news trickled out that the Mormon Church was largely responsible for Prop. 8's success, and was actively trying to hide that, I was of course upset with them.
I am not exactly anti-Mormon. I am anti-religion generally. I would give religions respect, if they had any for me, an agnostic gay person. But they don't. In fact, they actively try to persecute me. So spare me please. If you are offended, I am sorry. I realize not everybody of any faith is exactly the same. But the Mormon Church as an entity IS against gay people, and they keep proving it.
As for the picture and the excerpted article, I did not write or create them, I only passed them along to the readers. I find the photo hilarious, and authenticity wasn't really the point. You must have really hated the movie "Latter Days," eh?
That picture is extremely disrespectful, as is the article. As a junior in high school, I see many gay people, and I have friends who are gay. We do not hate gay people, never have. It would be widely appreciated if people would stop bashing on our religion, we have done nothing to make people feel that they should be rude. Whether you are anti-Mormon, or just anti-religion, it gives you no right to jump to assumptions. To any religion.
ReplyDeletePeople who are Mormon who come out as gay are excommunicated, am I correct? The Mormon Church played a large--and somewhat secretive role (to the tune of millions of dollars) to pass Proposition 8. Proposition 8 was an effort to remove existing rights from an entire group of people. I'm sorry if you are offended by my snarky attitude. But I didn't take that picture, I just passed it along. Already out there.
ReplyDeleteI'm Portuguese and I have a question to ask you, if you please, about a situation that intrigues me: what happens to the legal same-sex marriages carried previously to the approval of that Proposition 8? Are people married or not?
ReplyDeleteFor me, as a European, it is kind of strange that citizens of the same country have different rights. Some can marry, some can't.
As you probably know, in Portugal same-sex marriage has been recently approved and, surprisingly, the catholic church hasn't campaigned officially against.
manuela
Manuela,
ReplyDeleteMy husband and I were married in Palm Springs in June 2008. We were one of 18,000+ couples to do so. Proposition 8 put a stop to any future same-sex marriages, but did not nullify our marriage. In California presently, there are the following classes of marriage:
- Heterosexual single people who can marry
- Heterosexual married people (who can divorce and remarry)
- Homosexual married people (who can divorce but may not remarry)
- Homosexual single people who cannot marry at all
The weirdest part of this whole measure is that heterosexuals can marry any other opposite-sex person who is not:
- closely related
- under age
- already married, but not divorced
But, those elible to marry:
- do not need to love each other
- do not need to KNOW each other
- can be divorced unlimited times
- can have a criminal record
- can have a criminal record AND be in prison
- can be any kind of vile thing that Christians find perverse and/or sinful, as long as they are opposite-sexed
- can even be gay, as long as they marry the opposite sex
If the goal of restrictive marriage legislation was to a) conform to biblical law, b) affirm morality or c) a combination of the two, shouldn't those two lists be very, very different?
James
ReplyDeleteThank you for your answer. I stepped on your blog looking for ‘mormons’ and what I read triggered my curiosity about Preposition 8. As far as I read here in the press, it only works in California and not in other states in the US.
The legal situation in Portugal is more or less similar to what happens in your country – not considering the newly approved legislation about same-sex marriage, not yet in force - but what really amazes me is that part “already married, but not divorced”.
How come? It would be impossible here, unless married elsewhere abroad without legal knowledge of the Portuguese authorities.
With a few exceptions, in this part of the Atlantic the anti-marriage arguments focus more on marriage being socially intended to raise families and less on morality. Even the Catholic Church front people prefer talking about biology rather than morality. Religion and religious points of view are considered a strictly private matter, not having place in a discussion about politics or social issues. No-one would cite God or the Bible.
manuela
Oh, now I notice I misunderstood the 'already married, but not divorced'. I missed the 'not'.
ReplyDeleteBoys and girls from 16 years on can marry under consent of their parents, but no-one does. As far as I know, only gipsy people marry very young and I guess it's for them the law still exists. But I'm not sure, of course.
manuela